Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1993 05:53:29 -1000 From: mgraves@leadingedg.win.net (Michael Graves) Message-Id: <15@leadingedg.win.net> Subject: The REAL value in the shunt bridle In reading all the messages about Dean's new shunt bridle a few thoughts come to mind. Legal issues aside the true value of this new bridle is not its design or how it works, but what it forces us to do. It brings us to re-evaluate a long stagnant area of stunt kite design. It has been a long time since the last quantum leap in stunt kite design. As every new kites arrives on scene we look for design differences that get smaller and smaller. Material science has provided us with some really nice rods and cloth, but the actual kites designs don't change much. As someone who has designed kites from scratch I agree with Dean that a new design can take years to complete. It is a very valuable exercise to occasionally abandon ones assumptions about prefered geometry, construction techniques, etc. and see what comes of it. Thank you Dean (and Mike Simmons,too.) for making us think about bridles in a way that we might have missed entirely. Michael Graves = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1993 10:39:23 -1000 From: salanne@convex.csc.FI (Simo Salanne) Message-Id: <1993Nov24.203923.14093@funet.fi> Organization: Finnish University and Research Network FUNET Subject: Re: The REAL value in the shunt bridle In <15@leadingedg.win.net> mgraves@leadingedg.win.net (Michael Graves) writes: (text deleted) >Thank you Dean (and Mike Simmons,too.) for making us think about >bridles in a way that we might have missed entirely. ... and Thomas Ehrfurt, who used cross bridle in Speedwing, before Mike. Simo Salanne -- Simo.Salanne@csc.fi -- = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1993 13:49:21 -1000 From: steveth@netcom.com (Steve Thomas) Message-Id: Organization: VisionAire, San Francisco, CA Subject: Re: The REAL value in the shunt bridle In article <15@leadingedg.win.net> mgraves@leadingedg.win.net (Michael Graves) writes: > >It has been a long time since the last quantum leap in stunt kite >design. As every new kites arrives on scene we look for design >differences that get smaller and smaller. Material science has >provided us with some really nice rods and cloth, but the actual >kites designs don't change much. > Last year, just spent a small fortune for a pair skis. The pair I bought were the "latest" design. I could have purchased the previous year's model for about 40 0.000000e+00ss. The previous year, I bought a very old (< 2 years) pair for only $70--I paid more than 5 times that for my new pair (these are cross-country skating skis if anybody is wondering). Now, if I showed most people the two pairs of skis--radically different in performance, my new pair being well worth the price--most people who do not ski would not be able to see any difference between the two pairs. They are basically the same shape--as they have been for decades. The difference is subtle. The difference in performance, however, is radical. The point is, I think kites have evolved to a basic shape (the "dart" shape) and that we will now continue to see changes, but I really doubt the *basic* shape is going to change much. As such, I take issue with the claim that there have not been any quantum leaps in design lately. Last year saw many, many new and innovative designs that pushed the limits of the sport in various directions: ease of use, radical-ness, quality, light wind ability, and other items. Perhaps your local kite store does not stock anything new, or perhaps your doing the eqivalent of the non-skier looking at a ski catalog and saying, "well, they're all just long-thin sticks with slippery bottoms...". I think that if you don't notice these "quantum leaps", you ought to take a closer look... -- _______ Steve Thomas steveth@netcom.com "I'm doing just fine. I took stock in a Mace company right before society crumbled." -- Selma/Simpson's = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1993 19:09:25 -1000 From: jeffy@syrinx.umd.edu (Jeffrey C. Burka) Message-Id: <2d4325$c8u@umd5.umd.edu> Organization: University of Maryland at College Park Subject: Re: The REAL value in the shunt bridle In article <1993Nov24.203923.14093@funet.fi> salanne@convex.csc.FI (Simo Salanne) writes: >... and Thomas Ehrfurt, who used cross bridle in Speedwing, >before Mike. ...and Randy Tom, who used the cross bridle on the HyperKites Star Cruiser *long* before Thomas Ehrfurt. ;-) Jeff (who, thinking it was the case, just confirmed on his just-shy-of-eight- years-old stack of Star Cruisers that they do in fact have a cross bridle) -- |Jeffrey C. Burka | "When I look in the mirror, I see a little clearer/ | |SAFH Lite [tm] | I am what I am and you are you too./ Do you like | |jeffy@syrinx.umd.edu | what you see? Do you like yourself?" --N. Cherry | = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1993 07:20:45 -1000 From: lmarshal@pnfi.forestry.ca (Larry Marshall) Message-Id: Organization: Canadian Forest Service - Petawawa National Forestry Institute Subject: Re: The REAL value in the shunt bridle In steveth@netcom.com (Steve Thomas) writes: >The point is, I think kites have evolved to a basic shape (the "dart" shape) >and that we will now continue to see changes, but I really doubt the *basic* >shape is going to change much. You gave me a chuckle over this one. You see... a couple nights ago I was reading some aviation history. It was a commentary by a guy on airplane design. He said the same thing with respect to the basic shape of airplanes. He was talking about biplanes. -- =========================================================================== # Larry Marshall ./\. lmarshal@pnfi.forestry.ca # # Canadian Forest Service _|\| |/|_ # # Petawawa National Forestry Institute \ / Tel: (613) 589-2880 # # Chalk River, Ontario K0J 1J0 >______< Fax: (613) 589-2275 # # CANADA / # =========================================================================== = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =